Beethoven

topic posted Thu, January 24, 2008 - 10:36 PM by  offlineHank
We all know that Bob liked Beethoven more than Mozart (which seems to demonstrate his good taste in music).

So, any other's feel the same? Listening to music (as in: sitting in a chair and really listening as opposed to passively hearing music as a distraction) brings great joy to my life. What are your favorite Beethoven recordings?

A few of mine are:
-Symphony #9 (the 1942 recording conducted by Furtwangler and remastered in 1999 by Maggi Payne; Music & Arts CD 4653)
-Symphony #6 (the Harnoncourt recording on Teldec)
-Symphony #5 and #7 (obviously the Kleiber on DG, is there any other choice?)
-Archduke and Ghost Trios (performed on period instruments by Immerseed, Beths, and Bylsma: Sony SK 51353)
-Sonatas (Walstein, Les Adieux, and Appassionata by Emil Gilels; DG 419 162-2)
-Piano Concertos 1-5 (Pierre-Laurent Aimard and Nikolaus Harnoncourt; Teldec 0927 47334-2)
-Of course I'd have to add: the Cantata on the Death of Emperor Joseph II (the one comissioned by members of the Bavarian Illuminata when Beethoven was only 19 years of age; my favorite is the Hyperion release conducted by Matthew Best; CDA66880).
-The newest recording of the 5th piano concerto by Helene Grimaud coupled with sonata 28 on DG sounds incredible to my ears!

I'm sure some of you have favorites as well. I don't know why, but for some reason (not based on any evidence) I picture Bob listening to the Karajan recordings.
posted by:
Hank
Chicago
  • Re: Beethoven

    Mon, January 28, 2008 - 8:56 PM
    Seriously...am I to believe that nobody on this tribe has a favorite recording of Beethoven's music?
    • Re: Beethoven

      Mon, January 28, 2008 - 11:57 PM
      I'm not an expert in comparison but the one I listen to the most is the...

      Beethoven: Symphony #9 in D minor, Op. 125 - 1. John Eliot Gardiner; Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique

      This comes from the box set of all the symphonies done with a nod toward original instruments.
      I love it.
      cheers
      RevV
      • Re: Beethoven

        Tue, January 29, 2008 - 9:46 AM
        Hard to beat period instruments and historically informed performances. I've got quite a few of Gardiners baroque recordings. Great stuff!
        • Re: Beethoven

          Tue, January 29, 2008 - 10:02 AM
          I'm partial to Bernstein/NY Philharmonic Symphony #9 on CBS Masterworks. It's the only piece of music that has brought me to tears (of joy!)

          Also - Piano Concerto #5 by Rudolph Serkin with Seiji Ozawa and the Boston Symphony Orchestra

          and then there's Vladimir Horowitz's recordings of Sonatas #8, 14 & 23

          I can highly recommend Mozart Serenade in B-Flat M for 13 Winds. The second movement is an incredible study in harmony/voicing and syncopation. The Telarc recording with Sir Charles Mackerras and Orchestra of St Luke's is memorable
          • Re: Beethoven

            Tue, January 29, 2008 - 9:54 PM
            Correction on the Mozart. It's the third movement - the adagio
            • Re: Beethoven

              Wed, January 30, 2008 - 11:22 AM
              Somewhere, possibly on Wilson's "official" site, I came across this list:

              RAW’s Desert Island Music Choices:
              1. Beethoven's 9th Symphony
              2. Beethoven's 7th Symphony
              3. Vivaldi's Four Seasons
              4. Orff's Carmina Burana
              5. Bach's Brandenburg Concerti
              6. Bach's Goldberg Variations
              7. Mozart's Piano Concerti
              8. Beethoven's Piano Concerti
              9. Scott Joplin Rags on harpsichord

              I've given most of these a listen as a result, but I can't say I'll ever be a connoisseur of classical music. In college I used to listen to some of Bach's French suites when I was really, really hungover. I do enjoy Bobby McFerrin's conduction of Mozart.
              • Re: Beethoven

                Wed, January 30, 2008 - 12:00 PM
                having a desert Island list of all one genre
                is telling....
                not as diverse as I would ever want by far
                but perhaps for RAW
                the diversity of the rest of his life made the
                peace of a certain type of music all the more resonant.
                cheers
                RevV
                • Re: Beethoven, etc.

                  Tue, February 5, 2008 - 12:44 PM
                  Well, Bob's top ten list included the nine already posted and In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida. I wouldn't see Scott Joplin as the same genre as Bach. Bob prefered classical music, but his list includes music from three centuries and a number of different countries.

                  I listen to lots of Beethoven, and in recent years I've come to favor Furtwangler's 1942 Ninth, Horenstein's Missa Solemnis, and Solomon's recordings of the piano sonatas op. 106, 109 and 111.
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Rafi Zabor

                    Tue, February 5, 2008 - 12:58 PM
                    The wonderful writer Rafi Zabor has posted these Beethoven reviews on Amazon.

                    For Horenstein's Missa:
                    Elysium, June 1, 2005
                    By Joel Rafi Zabor (Brooklyn, NY United States) - See all my reviews


                    For a long time one could lament the fact that there was no definitive performance of Beethoven's Missa Solemnis on record, and make do with the best elements of the recordings available: Gardiner's (rather too tidily English) clarity and speed, Karajan's (largely rhetorical, often meaningless) command, Bernstein's (overpushed) heartfelt commitment, and so on. Wilhelm Furtwangler, whom I esteem above all other Beethoven conductors, considered himself inadequate to conduct what Beethoven himself, at least for a time, regarded as his greatest work. We are fortunate that Jascha Horenstein made a very serious attempt at it and that it was recorded. The sound is fairly good mono at best, but you can hear everything, and it is a performance of tremendous power and commitment. Horenstein's formal grasp of this immense piece is obvious from early on and his expressive power is unstinting throughout. The solo singing is particularly fine, and I have never heard any conductor find the through-line of the Agnus Dei/Dona nobis pacem last movement: for a long time I thought that Beethoven, the greatest composer of resounding conclusions, had for once failed to end a work convincingly, but I think it no more. Horenstein partly locates the core of this last music in Beethoven's deep grief over the failure of the democratic possibilities of Europe to which he had given his heart in youth, only to lose them to Bonapartist wars and subsequent repression--a similar feeling powers the transcendent idealism of the last movement of the Ninth--and Horenstein, with his deep experience of the 20th Century's disasters and his capacity for registering depths of despair--think of his great, unsparing BBC recording of Mahler's Ninth--finds a power and continuity in this music that no one else has touched, and the chiming of Pacem, Pacem at the finish no longer sounds tacked on or unachieved but the earned, resounding triumph of Beethoven's visionary, heartfelt, striving artistry. In one of his few obviously Furtwanglerian moves, Horenstein takes a ritardando clearly implied in Beethoven's writing so that the last pages feel like an enormous, fulfilled outbreath of peace and mercy found at the end of long struggle. Eugen Jochum's superb recording of the Missa was only very briefly available on CD, and his full-hearted faith gave wonderful voice to Beethoven's complex utterance, but Horenstein's ability to also confront the annihilation of hope goes beyond Jochum's noble musicmaking to give us a more complete and profound Missa Solemnis, I think, than has been achieved on record by anyone before. No one who loves Beethoven will want to be without this recording. Horenstein's reading of the Unfinished is also very fine.

                    The preceding paragraph was written when this recording was new to me, over a year ago. Further listening has only increased my appreciation of it. I'd like to correct the overemphasis on the last movement by pointing out the exhilaration of Horenstein's Gloria--not the fastest on record, but the perhaps most electrifying and the best understood (never mind that overexcited tympanist at the end)--and the deep formal intelligence at work in the Credo, for which his slow initial tempo performs a masterstroke analagous to that in the opening of his Mahler 8th. Then there is the astonishing singing of Teresa Stich-Randall, worth the price of admission on its own. The only thing I can say in demurral is that the excellent mono fails to capture the tonal glory of the solo violin in the Benedictus, for which you need another recording, the Jochum if you can find it, or good luck elsewhere. For me, this is simply one of the great recordings of all time.

                    Third take: I've recently spent some time with James Levine's grand version, which is almost good enough to be a hi-fi stereo backup for the Horenstein--Vienna Philarmonic, star-studded cast, unbelievable chorus, well judged tempos and architectonics--but it sounds to me as if the solo singers, especially Placido Domingo, though Jessye Norman's not far behind, are singing more for themselves than for the music, or--to put it a shade less subjectively--with a continuous breadth of vibrato more appropriate to nineteenth century opera than to what is still, however vastly expanded, a classical idiom. It's a glamorous, Hollywoodish performance of high quality that provides the histrionics and gilds the surfaces with greater attention than it gives to the depths, where Horenstein is still, as far as I know, unmatched. Also, surprisingly, the vibrato of the solo violin in the Benedictus is so broad that most of the music is effectively out of tune. On the other hand, I'm warming to the Herrweghe recording, which has always seemed a mite underpowered but now comes as something of a relief. Horenstein still rules, and I hope they'll bring back the Jochum.

                    For Furtwanger's Ninth:
                    The Ultimate, August 14, 2000
                    I'd just like to add my voice to the already eloquent five-star chorus. I don't know if there is such a thing, but to me this is the single greatest set of orchestral recordings there has ever been, and the Ninth seems to me the greatest orchestral performance ever recorded--I really do not understand the consensus opinion that the Bayreuth performance is better. The Berlin Ninth is unique, and for a very good reason, as described by other reviewers below. There is nothing like it anywhere else in music.

                    That said, the set is not perfect. Personally I prefer a Fifth Furtwangler recorded in 1947, despite the clinkers in the solo parts, and the sumptuous EMI Pastorale might be preferable to the one here; but taken all in all this set is unequalled: the greatest Eroica and Ninth ever recorded, and you can take it from there. As for the sound, those of us who have lived with various LP versions over the years know what a superb job was done by the engineers who put this set together.

                    I've learned over the years that Furtwangler will never be for everyone--witness the demurrals in the reviews below--but it seems to me that anyone who is aware of music's highest expressive and spiritual potential will find a way to these astounding performances.

                    I'd also recommend that anyone enthralled by this set should also find Furtwangler's last performance of the Ninth, in Lausanne, three months before his death; much of the muscularity is gone, and Ninth stands revealed, in the conductor's last manner, as a radiant piece of music from which all struggle has been refined away by higher contemplation. It is superlatively well recorded, and although it lacks the apocalyptic drama of the 1942 performance, you can hear in great detail what was always Furtwangler's extraordinary sense of inner voicings and texture, which, transposed to one's experience of the Berlin Ninth, deepens further one's experience of this Mount Everest of all orchestral recordings.
  • Eva
    Eva
    offline 8

    Re: Beethoven

    Thu, March 20, 2008 - 7:41 PM
    I love Beethoven's PIano Concerto #5 too and The Ode to Joy, of course. But back to the Piano Concerto: It's called "The Emperor." Does anyone know why? It sounds to me like the female orgasm. I can totally hear the clitoral stimulation with breath escalation and the rising anticipation and ecstasy paired with this tenderness towards the creature providing the pleasure. And then about half-way through, it totally changes tune & is just this upbeat faster tune. I think that part is the mood & attitude of the woman in dealing with the rest of her daily activities after getting off so good.

    So I wonder about it being called the Emperor & I think about Thoth Tarot and the Emperor/Empress pairing. I wonder if the whole song isn't about the emperor who can totally conquer a woman's body & love through how tenderly he touches her. Wondering like that makes me like it even more! But feel free to burst my bubble with any actual truths about it :-)
    • Re: Beethoven

      Thu, March 20, 2008 - 10:10 PM
      Eva:

      Well...I'll never be able to listen to the Emperor concerto the same way. :-)

      Beethoven dedicated this concerto to Archduke Rudolf who was one of his pupils (and a patron; Beethoven was a "freelancer" and received patronage throughout his life). Beethoven did not give it the title of "Emperor" (nor would he like this title as he changed the title of his third symphony after learning that Napoleon had become a dictator). Due to the heroic feeling that this work induces, it has been referred to as "The Emperor" concerto for many years.

      Again, Eva, I think you've forever changed the way I'll hear this wonderful concerto!
      • Re: Beethoven

        Thu, March 20, 2008 - 10:13 PM
        Addendum: A new recording of this concerto by Helene Grimaud on DG is spectacular. I have all of her releases on DG and she really has an incredible manner of playing Beethoven. If you haven't heard her interpretation of this work I bet you'll like it quite a bit.
        • Eva
          Eva
          offline 8

          Re: Beethoven

          Fri, March 21, 2008 - 12:13 PM
          Thanks Hank! It's really interesting to hear what was really up with the artist at the time, & the bit about Napoleon too. I look forward to checking out some of the recordings recommended here also.

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